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Author Topic: He doesn't need a 504 - an IHP will act as his 504  (Read 12523 times)

Description: (Stinky) Pg 3=504 winning argument; Pg 5=1 mo

Offline ajasfolks2

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He doesn't need a 504 - an IHP will act as his 504
« on: March 11, 2013, 08:28:50 PM »
Original thread started 06/09/2008.



Opening Post:

Stinky
Quote
Why I find this amusing at the moment is beyond me....

Please no quotes !

Have been told by Nurse that IHP is the same as the 504 and we just use an IHP. 

I told her that's fine but we want the 504 and can use the IHP as the "action plan" but I want the 504 designation as he is eligible for it and I think it's the best way to go.  :)

She got back to me and suggested that I call the lawyer.  So I did.  I got her assistant who said that I was interpreting the law "differently" - after ascertaining who she was I explained that I was interpreting the law correctly and proceeded to read from our states newly released FA guidelines...here's a key sentence..."A student with a life threatening food allergy qualifies as a disabled student under Section 504, if in a licensed health care provider's assesment, the student is at risk of having a life-threatening (anaphylactic) reaction." 

I emailed her the new state guidelines and also this link

http://www.ed.gov/policy/rights/reg/ocr/34cfr104.pdf

and this

Here is another useful link from the OCR where they define allergy as a hidden disability.

http://www.ed.gov/about/offices/list/ocr/docs/hq5269.html

Also please know that we have provided to the school a letter from X's allergist describing the life threatening nature of his peanut allergy.


So far I have been told that an IHP is for medical things while the 504 is for academic things

That an IHP is the same as the 504

and that this is confusing for parents

I actually really like this nurse and think she is just doing what she has been told to do by people who are "interpreting the law differently"

I have 7  6 business days before school ends to get this settled. 

I think I am going to be up against the "is learning affected" argument.

I am not going to send anything more until I get a response.   IMO what I have sent is enough.

Oh and the nurse said that the only difference btn the IHP and the 504 is who is involved in administering them....  :)  fine I want the 504. 

If they push back I'll ask for their response in writing that they have denied him an eligibility meeting and deemed him ineligable.   Right?

edited out some detail... :)



Follow on posts:

Momcat 6/9/2008
Quote
If IHP and 504 are the same, why don't they want to give you the 504?  Hmmmm?

504 is for academic things makes me think they'll try the ol' learning's-not-affected schtick.

Yadda-yadda-yadda.  They never learn.



Scout 6/9/2008
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~) Oh Boy!

Sorry, (but you know your stuff so I'm sure they will give in....)
Mine did after I dropped off the OCR/FED gov pages, highlighted...



McCobbre 6/9/2008
Quote from: 27 post_id=87179 date=1213045607
SB--your situation is mine one month ago.  :-)  I will pm you.



Stinky 6/9/2008
Quote
Quote
If IHP and 504 are the same, why don't they want to give you the 504?  Hmmmm?

504 is for academic things makes me think they'll try the ol' learning's-not-affected schtick.

Yadda-yadda-yadda.  They never learn.


yup...that's where they are going. 

Is there one best arguement for that or do I just go 'major life activity' by 'major life activity' as McCobbre (my hero) did and posted so nicely for us!  :)

I didn't ask why they didn't want to give the 504 - but everytime she said that they are the same I just said "great then I'll take the 504" :)



Momcat 6/9/2008
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A few clonks with McCobbre's major life activity sledgehammer ought to do it.   :crazy:

Hopefully, they won't be too stubborn about the whole thing if they see that you are loaded for bear  ;D



Member name Deleted 6/9/2008
Quote
Honestly, I am not worried about you because you WILL get this.  You are educated enough, you know the law...now you just have to convince them of it(that it's a law....not an IHP!).  I wonder why they had you call the lawyer too, are they the districts 504C??  That is who you should be calling, and they had better know the difference between the 504 and an IHP, or my dear, you are in for the long haul! 
You will get it though, I have a funny feeling you just woke that poor group up!!!  HUGS



McCobbre 6/9/2008
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That's right.  You will.

Here--feel free to borrow this mantra anytime you need it in the coming weeks:

Quote
This is not right. It must be righted. I can do that. My son needs that. He qualifies for a 504 plain and simple. I've made a sound, sound case for it. They absolutely must grant him a 504. And they will.



mkmom 6/9/2008
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I'm having the same problem with my dd's new school district. Frustrating, frustrating, frustrating.



Stinky 6/9/2008
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Thanks everyone - especially McCobbre the Wonderful!

I'll keep you posted. 

I didn't get a call back today.  So tomorrow morning I'll call and/or email and see what happens. 

I feel very confident that I have my facts straight and that the law is clear and that my son needs this.

What do they say about bear....sometimes you eat the bear and sometimes the bear eats you.....well I got a mighty big appetite for bear!  :)



Member name Deleted 6/10/2008
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You know your stuff, Stinkerbutt......go get em  ;D

I was also told that the SD attorney said that the IHP is the same as a 504, presented the facts and got the 504 without too much trouble (attorney wanted the school nurse to talk to allergist, which I allowed because our nurse is wonderful) and they also wanted an updated letter from the allergist......smooth sailing from there on getting the designation and accommodations. 

You go Stinkerbutt!   :thumbsup:



momofjandl 6/10/2008
Quote
Kudos to you for being so level headed throughout the process. You def have your ducks in a row and it's just a matter of time before they cave.

Don't you hate it when you call and they know "all" about you? I've called the principals office and her assistant knew "exactly" who I was and I had never spoken to her.

I hope you get this wrapped up by end of year. It still amazes me why schools refuse to give the 504.



WarmT 6/10/2008
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Stinkerbutt,

I wanted to add some of what our attorney had to say about this issue during our hearing.

The existence of an IHCP is not a mitigating measure. Mitigating Measures are devices or practices a student uses on his/her own to reduce or eliminate the effects of the student�s impairment. It�s something that the student can use without assistance by the school.

The existence of an IHCP absolutely is not a substitute for section 504 eligibility.

We heard the school�s view essentially is that if you can write an IHCP then you don't really need a 504 plan. This is a flawed premise, because one is not intended to substitute another.  IHCP's are not intended to trump or replace 504 eligibility. IHCP's might become part of 504 plans, but it's not a substitute.

Hope some of this might help.

Hugs,

WarmT



Member name Deleted 6/10/2008
Quote
Warm T,
What would you say to a district that wants to split accomodations between an IHP and 504. Some repeat themselves and there doesn't seem to be rhyme or reason to the split.

TIA  :)



melissa 6/10/2008
Quote
I ditto everything above. An IHP can and should be a PART of a 504, but the 504 insures that your child is not excluded from ANYTHING due to his/her food allergy. Our district sped supervisor explained this very clearly to me, and I wish I had written down what she said.
Keep going.You will win in the end I know it!
Melissa



END PAGE 1, original thread

« Last Edit: February 15, 2017, 02:17:59 PM by ajasfolks2 »
Is this where I blame iPhone and cuss like an old fighter pilot's wife?

**(&%@@&%$^%$#^%$#$*&      LOL!!   

Offline ajasfolks2

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Re: He doesn't need a 504 - an IHP will act as his 504
« Reply #1 on: March 11, 2013, 08:46:39 PM »
Begin Page 2:

Stinky 6/10/2008
Quote
Quote
Stinkerbutt,

I wanted to add some of what our attorney had to say about this issue during our hearing.

The existence of an IHCP is not a mitigating measure. Mitigating Measures are devices or practices a student uses on his/her own to reduce or eliminate the effects of the student�s impairment. It�s something that the student can use without assistance by the school.

The existence of an IHCP absolutely is not a substitute for section 504 eligibility.

We heard the school�s view essentially is that if you can write an IHCP then you don't really need a 504 plan. This is a flawed premise, because one is not intended to substitute another.  IHCP's are not intended to trump or replace 504 eligibility. IHCP's might become part of 504 plans, but it's not a substitute.

Hope some of this might help.


thank you !  I think that will be helpful. 



artlvr 6/10/2008
Quote
SB,
I am so very sorry your school is playing hard ball. :-/

I'm in a similar situation (can't get a 504 as of yet for other reasons). I'm going to be contacting a few more people in a couple of days. I'll get back to you when I get a response to let you know if my "lead" is viable or not in assisting you as well.

 :console:
Hang in there...



Stinky 6/10/2008
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Quote
SB,
I am so very sorry your school is playing hard ball. :-/

I'm in a similar situation (can't get a 504 as of yet for other reasons). I'm going to be contacting a few more people in a couple of days. I'll get back to you when I get a response to let you know if my "lead" is viable or not in assisting you as well.

 :console:
Hang in there...



I think they are just clueless about a 504 for LTFA right now.  I do think they would do a very good IHP that would cover a lot of inclusion type stuff - and that's great - there is a high level of awareness here - but it will be higher soon.   :)




ajasfolks2 6/11/2008
Quote
Quote
Quote
SB,
I am so very sorry your school is playing hard ball. :-/

I'm in a similar situation (can't get a 504 as of yet for other reasons). I'm going to be contacting a few more people in a couple of days. I'll get back to you when I get a response to let you know if my "lead" is viable or not in assisting you as well.

 :console:
Hang in there...


I think they are just clueless about a 504 for LTFA right now.  I do think they would do a very good IHP that would cover a lot of inclusion type stuff - and that's great - there is a high level of awareness here - but it will be higher soon.   :)





Roger, copy on the CLUELESS.


Hope they can handle your king-sized, ironclad CLUES!    ;D





artlvr 6/11/2008
Quote
Quote
I think they are just clueless about a 504 for LTFA right now.  I do think they would do a very good IHP that would cover a lot of inclusion type stuff - and that's great - there is a high level of awareness here - but it will be higher soon.  :)



Girl, I know you'll kick some royal FA BUTT!!!  :evil:
 :thumbsup:



Member name Deleted 6/11/2008
Quote
Quote
SB,
I am so very sorry your school is playing hard ball. :-/

I'm in a similar situation (can't get a 504 as of yet for other reasons). I'm going to be contacting a few more people in a couple of days. I'll get back to you when I get a response to let you know if my "lead" is viable or not in assisting you as well.

 :console:
Hang in there...


Artlvr,
PM me if you'd like a contact in our state for an advocate I know could help you.



aggiedog 6/13/2008
Quote
Stinker,
Did you see McCobbre's post regarding Gloucester and the OCR?

Very illuminating, including a reference that an IHP alone is NOT sufficient for children with LTFA, according to the OCR.  That NOT providing a 504 is in fact discrimination.



Stinky 6/13/2008
Quote
Quote
Stinker,
Did you see McCobbre's post regarding Gloucester and the OCR?

Very illuminating, including a reference that an IHP alone is NOT sufficient for children with LTFA, according to the OCR.  That NOT providing a 504 is in fact discrimination.


Roger that. 

I have it and am delivering it along with Saluda and much much more today.  :)

It's been a crazy week my boy has been and still is sick, my printer died, I am planning a trip aross the country and I work full time.  Luckily I work for myself or I would be fired!  And...by some grace DH took it upon himself to do ALL of the laundry!  He's home with ds now who is running a fever.  Strep was neg.  He's been out since last Thursday!



artlvr 6/13/2008
Quote
Quote
Stinker,
Did you see McCobbre's post regarding Gloucester and the OCR?

Very illuminating, including a reference that an IHP alone is NOT sufficient for children with LTFA, according to the OCR.  That NOT providing a 504 is in fact discrimination.


I don't get on the board as much as I'd like to these days... :P
If it's alright could you provide a link to that post?

Thank you.



McCobbre 6/13/2008
Quote
Hey artlvr--I've shamelessly posted it in several places. ;)

Here you go:


OCR Ruling on 504 Ineligibility--Gloucester
<LINK is to our reproduced thread here ~ajasfolks2>

Quote
OCR Ruling on 504 Ineligibility--Gloucester
  Involves PA & TNA



I'll have to go back and see if it mentions IHP specifically . . . .



McCobbre 6/13/2008
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Duh, of course it does. :banghead:  Do I not know this entire letter by heart??



aggiedog 6/13/2008
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McCobbre, that was one of the lines that really jumped out...that providing an IHP is NOT enough in the eyes of the OCR.

Just perhaps 504's carry legal mandates, so can not be simply ignored at the discretion of the school district, hmmm?   :evil:

Really puts a gaping hole in the "an IHP is just as good as a 504" argument, doesn't it?

Man, that whole letter makes me want to take up my sword and beat down our school and the public school...just because it would be fighting the good fight.

Must take deep breaths...



artlvr 6/13/2008
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Quote
Duh, of course it does. :banghead:  Do I not know this entire letter by heart??

 ;D  ;)

Don't be so hard on yourself. We all have our moments. :coolbeans: :heart:
(mine are more often than I'd like)

Thank you so much for providing that link. Now off to read...
 :coffee:




Stinky 6/16/2008
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Here is what I just got from the SD attny - after firing my bear cannon!  :)

I think you have this right, i.e. your child is eligible under Section 504 and the planning can be about the training, preparation, and responses related to the allergy and what the school is to do to support your child�s attendance safely at school.  There is the legal requirement for school districts in this state to have an emergency health care plan in writing, whereas Section 504 requires that the actual accommodations be in place even though there is no specific legal requirement to have what everyone calls a �Section 504 Plan;� however, we do use �Section 504 Plans� in our district as a best practice and as a way to document what a child needs.  Thus, the two can work together.

 

Thank you very for doing some of the research for me; and I wish your son much success and good health in school next fall.
   

******thoughts? 

I'm doing the happy dance but am not sure if I missing a little slant of something in here?



Momcat 6/16/2008
Quote
Quote
I'm doing the happy dance but am not sure if I missing a little slant of something in here?


Nah.... Do your happy dance.  She's just saving face  ;D

Now you just have to pin them down for a meeting date.

I like this part:

Quote
Thank you very for doing some of the research for me...


Some of the research?  Probably most if not ALL  ;)

I would love to see the message you sent that convinced her!  Feel free to PM me if you can share it.



End page 2, original thread.

« Last Edit: March 11, 2013, 08:55:15 PM by ajasfolks2 »
Is this where I blame iPhone and cuss like an old fighter pilot's wife?

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Offline ajasfolks2

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Re: He doesn't need a 504 - an IHP will act as his 504
« Reply #2 on: March 11, 2013, 09:23:00 PM »
Begin page 3, original thread:

Stinky 6/16/2008
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Here is our communication:  Attny = Bold

To respond to your communication with more detail I have taken your email from Wednesday (below in blue - indented - HERE BOLD AND Italyx) and added my thoughts to each comment.  I again want to thank you for your time and attention to this matter.   Hopefully the information I have provided will save you some time.

Unless I misunderstand the facts, however, I do not think that there is any disagreement about the conclusion that a severe allergy, depending on the facts, can qualify as a hidden disability for either children or employees under Section 504 and/or the Americans with Disabilities Act. 

Please see our �504 Written Request K (document attached)  which details k�s history and conditions including documentation from his physicians (full packet to be delivered on Monday, Allergist letter hand delivered to School on June, 9th  2008).   We would be pleased to provide any further documentation that you may request.

The issue I wanted to research for you is how Section 504 could or would apply to a student with peanut allergy disability who otherwise has no difficulty learning or accessing school.

He would not be able to access school without accommodations to compensate for his disability.

See also

http://www.fns.usda.gov/cnd/Guidance/special_dietary_needs.pdf

Section II A> Disability (Page 3-5) (pdf attached)

I wanted to look at this question further because usually, for children who have significant and severe allergies precipitated by episodic and unpredictable exposure to such things as bee stings or to contact/ingestion of certain foods, what is required would be to have critical emergency medical response planning in place.  

Agreed, emergency medical response planning is critical. 

Also critical are:

o       Measures taken to prevent exposure and thus a reaction

o       Training to recognize when a reaction is occurring

o       Access to learning which can not be accomplished without accommodations   

o       Inclusion and normalcy needs

For those children who do not require any form of classroom or structural accommodation and for whom the life-threatening potential of exposure to the cause of the allergic response does not per se interfere with learning, they are not typically considered as disabled children under Section 504 nor would adults be who do not required any accommodations in the work place.

Please see�.

http://www.504idea.org/custom_training.html

Found on the left side column under >  Resources > 504 Q&A > Evaluation tab)

Question 14: What if the major life activity impaired is not learning? Can the child still qualify under Section 504?

A common misperception in 504 is that a student must possess a physical or mental impairment that substantially limits the major life activity of learning in order to be 504 eligible. OCR�s position is that while it �may be true in a practical sense that most impairments that would be of concern in an education setting would be those that impair learning,� the major life activity of learning need not be the focus of the equation. �Students may have a disability that in no way affects their ability to learn, yet they may need extra help of some kind from the system to access learning. For instance, a child may have very severe asthma (affecting the major life activity of breathing) that requires regular medication and regular use of an inhaler at school. Without regular administration of the medication and inhaler, the child cannot remain in school.� Letter to McKethan, 23 IDELR 504 (OCR 1994).

Preparation to respond to the possibility of the medical crisis is extremely essential.

Yes of course I agree.  K has had to be treated in a crisis by school personnel at his preschool.  Their training and knowledge enabled them to act quickly, correctly and decisively.  However he is continuously excluded from activities, and has had to be kept home many times during holidays, �events� and activities involving foods due to his allergy when a safe alternative would be easily accomplished.   

When school districts do Section 504 planning for children with disabilities it is because their hidden or patent disabilities significantly interfere with their ability to learn and/or access education/school (for example, they may have ADHD and need to take more time on tests in a quiet area) or to physically access the school environment (for example, to get into the school ramps are required or a child may need to be helped to take medication during the school day.)   

I liken the allergen free class room to the school ramp.  Without that accommodation he can not attend school.   When he was first diagnosed (based on his allergist�s recommendation) we pulled him from his preschool until they created a safe (nut free environment) and updated staff training


Stinky, cont'd 6/16/2008
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Many students and employees have disabilities that do not significantly interfere with learning or working, and they require no Section 504/ADA accommodations either at school or in their employment.  A child whose disability does not significantly interfere with the child�s  ability to learn or with some other major life activity does not require a Section 504 plan and therefore may not be seen as a Section 504 child. 

In his request document I will detail the major life activities that are significantly impacted.

There are many, many of those children attending public schools who have hearing aides, glasses, artificial organs/limbs, heart murmurs, blood disorders, and many other physical and medical conditions which do not interfere with their education and do not require any modifications in the classroom or school house setting and whose disabilities � hidden or not hidden -- do not require any Section 504 accommodations at all.   There are, of course, many others even with similar disabilities which do require accommodations.   These situations are all individually considered and decided and must be.

Yes they must be looked at individually.   

Again the question is:  what is the application of Section 504 for children whose only disabilities requires an emergency medical response and which do not interfere on any on-going or regular basis with the children�s learning.

Learning is affected by living with the constant knowledge that a common food source could kill you and that you are never 100% safe.  Even in an allergen free home contamination can occur through the mail, clothes and shoes, visitors, pets, pests, etc.  In a school environment the best that you can do is to reduce the risk, but the allergic child/person must always be aware of their surroundings in order to protect themselves.  They must develop strategies and mechanisms to advocate for themselves in an environment where well meaning authority figures might unknowingly expose them or encourage them to eat food which may not be safe.   Most four year olds would happily accept candy from a teacher or chew on a pencil or skip washing their hands, but these are things that an allergic child must never do.  It is a constant effort for a young child to remember and accomplish these things. 

I do think it is entirely possible that as the wave of children with life threatening food allergies age into the school system that eventually the IDEA and IEP will be used as it will be shown that they actually qualify and would be better served through that process.  However with regard to the 504, as shown above, learning need not be affected and impact need not be ongoing.

I�m certain that there are children whose life threatening allergies could and do interfere with their learning at school and, therefore, would require some in-classroom modifications.  I think of a situation such the need for a built-in air cleaning or air conditioning system so a child with a severe dust or pollen allergy could breathe safely at school or he/she couldn�t attend school at all.  That is not the basis for your concern as I understand you to be saying that in the event of a major medical crisis related to your son�s condition that he will have an allergic response that will interfere then with his learning, his breathing, and other major health functions and that you want a plan to avoid that happening.  That would not typically be seen as any type of Section 504 application of which I am aware; but I wanted to look at that question for you. 

Saluda > copy to be delivered

Because the Section 504 plan for a sixth-grader with a peanut/tree nut allergy did not specifically identify the safety procedures implemented to protect the student from accidental exposure, the persons responsible for emergency responses, or the training to be provided to staff members, OCR concluded that a South Carolina district failed to develop an appropriate 504 plan. OCR noted that plans such as the student's need to set forth certain types of information, including the specific measures that will be taken to protect the student from accidental exposure, procedures regarding the proper handling of epinephrine, the identities of the persons responsible for emergency responses, and the sanctions that will be imposed on persons who harass the student because of his disability. "Although the [student's]plans meet some of the FAPE and other elements references above, they do not include -- or reference district policies, procedures or protocols that include-- [these specific terms]," OCR wrote. OCR also pointed out that the district failed to provide documentation to the student's parent regarding staff training. Furthermore, OCR observed that the district continued to serve peanut butter sandwiches in the school cafeteria for nine months, and that it failed to notify parents and students about the nature and


Stinky, cont'd
Quote
severity of the student's allergy. However, noting that the district signed a voluntary agreement addressing the parent's compliance concerns, OCR closed the parent's complaint

Gloucester > OCR resolution letter copy to be delivered and pdf attached and linked

http://www.wrightslaw.com/law/504/OCR.va.peanut.pdf

http://www.wrightslaw.com/info/sec504.index.htm

OCR ruled that Gloucester Co, VA denied FAPE

Complainant alleges that the school denied FAPE by failing to timely develop and implement a 504 or other Plan.  The school contends that it was not required to provide the student with a 504 because she doesn�t have a disability. 

 

OCR: �When a school division�s decision that a student is ineligible for Section 504 services could result in the death or serious illness of the student, there is a basis for finding that the case involves �extraordinary circumstances� that support a substantive OCR review of the Division�s decision.

 

Student had evidence that allergies could be life-threatening. from doctor�s letters (2).

 

OCR had �concerns regarding the consistency with Section 504 and Title II of the �result� or substance of the Division�s determination that the Student in ineligible for Section 504 services.  These concerns are also based on the fact that the evidence from the Student�s doctor was not contradicted by any other evidence, and that neither the evaluation team members nor anyone with whom they consulted had qualifications approaching those of the Student�s doctor to diagnose the nature and severity of the Student�s PTAs and the likelihood, nature and severity of the harm that could result from the Division�s failure to find the Student eligible for Section 504 services.�

 

OCR got the school to re-evaluate the student to determine �whether she is eligible for services under Section 504 and Title II, and, in doing so will comply with 504 process requirements.  The agreement provides that if the Division finds the Student is ineligible for services under Section 504 and Title II, it will provide OCR with documentation of its decision.  If the Division finds the student is eligible for Section 504 services, it will provide OCR with a draft 504 Plan that complies with the requirements and regulations under Section 504 and Title II. We note that one of these requirements is the FAPE requirement.�

 

Mystic Valley (pdf attached)

 

Mass. Bureau of Special Education Appeals Ordered: Mystic Valley Regional Charter School shall implement the following accommodation under Student�s 504 Plan: 1. No peanut/tree nut products are allowed in the Students classroom. 2. All other accommodations accepted by Parents shall continue to be implemented. 3. Child must have access to all classroom activities such as the celebration of Chinese New Year, accommodated accordingly ie., no restaurant prepared food, food preparation not to include peanut oil, etc.

 

The cases above document that indeed a 504 plan can and should be applied to children with peanut allergy. Please understand that while a plan to avoid a reaction and to treat one effectively is definitely needed, also needed is a plan to apply his comprehensive rights to access and inclusion in an educational setting. In my formal request I will detail some of the emotional aspects with documentation from experts in the field and as to how the constant exclusion can lead to risky behavior and may account for the increase in fatalities during the teen years.

I am unclear what you feel would be the need/benefit or advantage of having a Section 504 designation or plan for your son in addition to the required emergency health care plan.  Please feel free to share anything more that would help me understand your thinking about this.  

It is not required to demonstrate �need� in order to be eligible.   

A 504 plan offers broader protection than an IHP would alone.   We have been overwhelmingly pleased with Principal, Counselor, Nurse and all the teachers that we have observed and met at the Elementary.  However there is no assurance that they will continue in those roles.   A 504 designation would outline the duties of the School and its personnel that would supersede the employment or will of any of the individuals involved.  It would also encompass more than emergency reaction plan but include provisions for inclusion, access to all facets of school life, and enforcement procedures.

I have demonstrated that K qualifies for this Civil Rights protection and feel that it will not only benefit him in the long run but will also benefit the School District.

On Monday I will deliver to you hard copies of the attached request for a 504 designation as well as copies of his medical reports and the Saluda case.   

I hope that you have found this helpful and that we can move forward in developing a comprehensive plan for K�s safety and well being in


Stinky, cont'd:
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in his school career.

Should you have any questions or concerns I would be happy to address them.

Thank you very much for your time and concern in this matter.





melissa 6/16/2008
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Way to go SB!!! Wow, we need to sticky those responses...you've just done everyone's work for them!



Momcat 6/16/2008
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<SWISH!>

Was that the sound of a slam-dunk? ;D

I bet that attorney wet her pants when she read your message  :evil:



CMdeux 6/16/2008
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<snort>

READ it??

I'll bet she just about had a cow when she lifted it out of the envelope.   :evil:

Is that a bear cannon... or are you just happy to see me?   :misspeak:

Nice work, SB!!



Stinky, 6/16/2008
Quote

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ekta6EKhb2g

I am not worthy!

although I am proud of these two lines....

I liken the allergen free class room to the school ramp. Without that accommodation he can not attend school.

I do think it is entirely possible that as the wave of children with life threatening food allergies age into the school system that eventually the IDEA and IEP will be used as it will be shown that they actually qualify and would be better served through that process. However with regard to the 504, as shown above, learning need not be affected and impact need not be ongoing.



Momcat 6/16/2008
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Is that a bear cannon... or are you just happy to see me?   :misspeak:


Hard copies, coming up!  :misspeak:



Stinky 6/16/2008
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It was 3MB's

LOL!



McCobbre 6/16/2008
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Oh, you are rockin' SB!!! Totally rockin'!! 

It's brilliant, absolutely brilliant.  As someone recently said, "should be set to music."  ;D



McCobbre 6/16/2008
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Your SD's attorney just doesn't get that it's about access.



Stinky 6/16/2008
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Your SD's attorney just doesn't get that it's about access. 


I don't think she does get it.  This

to support your child�s attendance safely at school.

worries me a bit.

But that's ok.  We are on the right path.  :) 




ajasfolks2 6/16/2008
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How many freaking times did you have to beat your head against the brick wall and state again that 504 IS NOT ABOUT LEARNING (one-and-only) HAVING TO BE AFFECTED?!

GGA!  This is the SD atty?!

Or is she just playing games?

Printing THIS thread before I disconnect my printer later this week to move it.   ;D



lilpig 6/17/2008
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wow SB, you've done a great job with your response!!!   :thumbsup:



END PAGE 3!

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Offline ajasfolks2

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Re: He doesn't need a 504 - an IHP will act as his 504
« Reply #3 on: March 11, 2013, 09:34:14 PM »
Begin Page 4, original thread.


Stinky 6/17/2008
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Ok we've got the accomodation meeting set for August.  I spoke with nurse today - she called me - she is still confused about the 504 classification - but wasn't questioning it - we are moving forward - I could just tell that she didn't really get it

Question - What do I need to show that he has 504?  Is just a document that we all sign or what?



Momcat 6/17/2008
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Our SD has a form with boxes.  Eligible is checked and a reason written on the line.  Signed by principal (who is 504C), vp, nurse, us.



my3guys 6/18/2008
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Wow! Your responses and references were amazing!  All presented as being helpful and cooperative, but completely showing you know the law and putting the attorny in their place.  Excellent! And excellent reference for the rest of us.  Thank you so much!



McCobbre 6/18/2008
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Congratulations! You've come a step (or maybe 500) closer.  Yea you!

I've forms like Momcat mentioned on the web.  Our SD had its own form printed on its stationery (or at least with its logo).  It was something the Sped Dir typed up at our school and printed out there an hour after our planning meeting was over. Had we not gone directly into the planning meeting, I don't know what he'd given us.



joanna5 6/18/2008
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Wow, that is a fantastic letter and it clearly worked.  Kudos to you!



stlalohagal
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Here is our communication:  Attny = Bold

See also

http://www.fns.usda.gov/cnd/Guidance/special_dietary_needs.pdf

Section II A> Disability (Page 3-5) (pdf attached)



I had not seen these pages, I looked but must have looked right past that and went to the pack on page 25 where it gave examples on how to handle children w/ severe food allergies.  We gave this to our SD and they didn't even bat an eye, didn't even comment on it.  Our next 504 mtg doesn't even have food service in attendance.   :crazy:



Stinky 8/22/08
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finally found my own thread!



McCobbre 8/22/08
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I bet the delay was because of an identity crisis.  ;D



CMdeux 8/22/08
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That's what happens when you get old.... er.     :misspeak:  ;D



ajasfolks2 8/25/08
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bumping for my own OLD eyes tonight.



Stinky 9/30/2008
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bumping for someone
:)



Stinky 9/30/2008
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I guess I should update this while I am here....

I walked into the meeting with a fair amount of hastily pulled together info  - but I was ready to run the meeting if needed

the nurse however asked if she could run the meeting....we said yup, fine

so she did

our district has a form - it covered a lot

we got
peanut free room
peanut free table - with good cleaning practices
5 epi's and training of teacher, office staff, playground lady, lunch people and music teacher
ability to go on all field trips

I think that's it....but the best part was that the teacher decided that she wanted food free birthdays - and so did the other K teacher who has no food allergy kids in her class - they mentioned it at K orientation - it's in our handbooks - but they wouldn't put it in my 504

tHE big concern I have is that they are all trained on the epi - but I think the district is skipping the benadryl - I need to pick the ball back up and toss it at them....



McCobbre 9/30/2008
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You know, this makes me smile just rereading page 3.  :yes:

Thank you!



cya 10/1/2008
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Excellent!  :yes:



Scout 10/1/2008
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Wonderful!



END PAGE 4!

« Last Edit: March 11, 2013, 09:45:53 PM by ajasfolks2 »
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Offline ajasfolks2

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Re: He doesn't need a 504 - an IHP will act as his 504
« Reply #4 on: March 11, 2013, 09:45:40 PM »
Begin Page 5, original thread

Stinky 10/17/2008
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Update....one month into school and here's my email from today....I also just found out that the kids were given smarties and that they were not given enough time to eat the ice cream (that we rushed over) so it got put back into the lunchbox.....ITS A MESS! Isn't that a fine idea!  :banghead:  :crazy:


  • In addition to a general review, there are a few things that I would like to address specifically:


On the first day of school I found the epi pens locked in the office.  I know it was a hectic start but I did expect them to be placed as it is written in his plan.  At the least one should have been placed in his classroom but I’m pretty sure that no one knew where they were. 

I am also interested in the circumstances of ice cream being served today and some mention of popcorn party?  Who sponsored this and for what?  Did I miss this on a hand out or calendar somewhere?  Teacher called me today about the ice cream and due to a lucky fluke Dad was able to zip over and give BOY some safe ice cream just in time.  I had no idea that there was an event planned.   I had no time to check with the product manufacturer and was caught completely off guard.   I am thrilled though that Teacher called and we were able to resolve it easily but I’m confused as to the whole circumstances of ice cream being served to the class?  Had Dad not been home at the time BOY surely would have been left out. 

There is a question left unresolved (at least in my mind) regarding the administration of Benedryl prior to epi pen when only certain symptoms are present.   I did provide Benydryl but would like be reassured that school personnel have the correct action plan regarding its use.  I don’t recall getting an answer on that from NURSE with regard to current district policy.  His doctor’s orders are clear and may conflict with your policy and we need to get clarity here.

 I have a more complete safe snack list that I can provide to TEACHER to share with the class parents to make their snack selection easier.  I’d like to know if that is ok for her to use.  I gave her a copy of it early on and had hoped to get “clearance” on it sooner.

Is there anything that BOY needs to improve on – i.e. hand washing, communication, etc?
[/list]


Stinky 10/17/2008
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note...there was all nicey nice stuff before and after the part posted above....


CMdeux 10/17/2008
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That all looks like stuff to address.    :yes:

You should be sure to offer positive reinforcement where appropriate--

the fact that teacher NOTIFIED Dad about ice-cream, for example,'Good.'

  (Though.... 'advance notice' obviously.... "Better."   ;) )



Stinky 10/18/2008
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really they have done a great job - heck...food free bday parties...I still cant believe it....the teacher rocks...she is so young but right on target - I love it.  We feel very lucky to be at this school. > I bolded that in my email to them.

the part about the epi's - I just wanted to document that -



Stinky 10/23/2008
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ha ha ha ha ......oh my.  We had our meeting today.

It's pretty much a cluster.

I feel good that we are on the right track and but my god...it's like nothing has happened that should have.  sigh


Momcat 10/23/2008
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Oh, dear.  I know how that goes!  ~)


CMdeux 10/23/2008
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Oh, I'm sorry.

(Lot of this going around lately, huh? )

Group hug.    :console:

Do you need my Shakespeare insult mug to help with this?   :evil:   You know, just as a resource?


Stinky 10/23/2008
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I'll have to start another thread...

but WOW...

we have a new nurse - who had a new form - 3rd nurse - 4th form

many of the agreed upon things have not happened

BUT the good news is that the new nurse doesn't seem to know the district policy to ignore benedryl orders....so I didn't tell her ...and the new form that she picked had a better action plan anyway

she's just a bit scattered - but I'm ok with that - I think she is competent


Stinky 5/24/2009
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Bumping up for several current threads


Stinky 6/28/2009
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bump for me


ajasfolks2 6/29/2009
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I posted the link to this thread in the Resource sub-board in the
"504 Links and Tips" thread.

Didn't check to see if it was already linked in that, just wanted to be sure.
 :thumbsup:


Mfamom 8/12/2009
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thinking this could be relevant in the near future.  BUMP

Where's that cute "BUMP" emoticon we had before?


Mfamom 3/15/2011
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bumping


eggallergymom 3/15/2011
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Thanks! This has been great reading. I have been cutting and pasting like a madwoman for my own uses. Thanks for doing all of this great research! :)


Stinky 3/15/2011
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it was a collective effort for sure..

but I did enjoy reading it again

we recently had a little bump in the road again and dh and I  employed the same helpful BUT WE KNOW OUR STUFF attitude....

they were stunned (all new players)
the district nurse TOLD ME about FAAN
he he...
I'm like ...yeah...I know who they are
but reading this thread again was nice...

eggallergymom - I think you need to step back and try to remove emotions - approach like a lawyer or surgeon - anyway...I know how hard it is  ((hugs)) to you....you are not alone!


END PAGE 5, original thread.

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Offline ajasfolks2

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Re: He doesn't need a 504 - an IHP will act as his 504
« Reply #5 on: March 11, 2013, 09:56:08 PM »
Begin Page 6, original thread


TwoDDs 3/16/2011
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Great stuff here!  I'm glad eggallergymom got the benefit of all of this.



Mfamom 6/9/2011
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raise Yellow



yellow 6/9/2011
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Thanks but I honestly do not have time to read it. I have to write a paper tonight and make a power point presentation for tomorrow morning. Then I have a major licensing exam to study for that I am taking Sat morning. this is the last thing I needed to deal with right now... ugh

I need quick things from other sites. I do not want to give the district this board.



Mfamom 6/9/2011
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Well, the first post has some good information. 



CMdeux 6/9/2011
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Gotcha.  Now that the thread is raised, though-- there may well be some links up front.

Because this was one of those where Stinky's school originally said "oh, he doesn't NEED a 504 plan, so we'll just do an IHCP instead."

That's why it came to mind.  Because I'm pretty sure that she combatted that line of reasoning with precisely the tools (and approach) you'll need.



CMdeux 6/9/2011
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Hey artlvr--I've shamelessly posted it in several places. ;)

Here you go:

OCR Ruling on 504 Ineligibility--Gloucester
<Link edited to new FAS board link by ajasfolks2>


I'll have to go back and see if it mentions IHP specifically . . . .


There's one.  It's also at Wrightslaw, btw.  A nice FA parent gave them a copy.   ;)

Saluda is another reference that may be useful and pertinent.

(I'll look to see if we still have a link to that one here.)



CMdeux 6/9/2011
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The letter that Stinky used (complete with references and nicely crisp verbiage to the SD attorney and 504 team) is on page 3 of this thread, yellow.  It's several posts, and I don't know if she is okay with it being quoted.

(But that wouldn't stop me from dropping it into a word document, reformatting, and hitting print, KWIM?)



Stinky 8/23/2011
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Stinky here - back to get info for upcoming school meeting...

---we got his IHP in the mail....NO mention of a 504.  LOL. 

<they don't know me very well - do they?>

anyone is welcome to use any of the information that I posted on this thread!



CMdeux 8/23/2011
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Oh dear, Stinky...

should I wish you THEM luck?  (I think that you're more than capable of making your OWN luck, as it happens...)  :yes:



ajasfolks2 9/12/2011
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Some excellent discussion in this thread:

http://allergy.hyperboards.com/action/view_topic/topic_id/20025



<<Moderator note -- I'll have to work to pull that thread's content, if not here, and then link to our board here.  Out of time tonite. ~ajasfolks2

ETA -- That link is to the thread started by Gail on 9/10/2011 titled
AllergicChild blog post re: 504 >>


END PAGE 6 and original thread!!

« Last Edit: March 11, 2013, 09:58:39 PM by ajasfolks2 »
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Offline Macabre

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Re: He doesn't need a 504 - an IHP will act as his 504
« Reply #6 on: May 05, 2014, 09:17:03 PM »
bump
Me: Sesame, shellfish, chamomile, sage
DS: Peanuts

Offline ajasfolks2

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Re: He doesn't need a 504 - an IHP will act as his 504
« Reply #7 on: August 22, 2014, 07:31:42 AM »
Couldn't get the USDA link (buried above) to work --

here is link (poss update) again

http://www.fns.usda.gov/sites/default/files/special_dietary_needs.pdf

Actual form is page 34 / 35 in the .pdf
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Offline ajasfolks2

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Re: He doesn't need a 504 - an IHP will act as his 504
« Reply #8 on: August 22, 2014, 11:42:07 PM »
Moved this topic to the regular SCHOOLS BOARD and stickied it for now.

Just too many questions I'm seeing at Facebook and getting from folks in own community as to LTFA and 504s . . . plus it is beginning of school year and parents are trying to understand what to do and how as they are face-first in the fire hose of school start up right now.

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Offline ajasfolks2

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Re: He doesn't need a 504 - an IHP will act as his 504
« Reply #9 on: September 12, 2014, 01:18:29 PM »
And WELCOME to any newbies reading this thread . . . and waving 'Hey' to old-timers who are reviewing and helping others!

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Offline ajasfolks2

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Re: He doesn't need a 504 - an IHP will act as his 504
« Reply #10 on: November 14, 2014, 01:37:59 PM »
Crossposting this here as seems relevant:

Re:  Question (re: 504 retraction)
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Offline Stinky10

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Re: He doesn't need a 504 - an IHP will act as his 504
« Reply #11 on: November 19, 2014, 01:14:50 PM »
Just noting here - pretty sure the my DS was the FIRST FA child to get a 504 for FA in my district and most likely the state.   There are now over 800 in my district alone.

Offline ajasfolks2

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Re: He doesn't need a 504 - an IHP will act as his 504
« Reply #12 on: May 26, 2015, 02:44:35 PM »
Wanting to be sure link to fairly recent OCR case with Virginia Beach is included here, as OCR took school/district to task for "only having IHCP/IHP for all the LTFA students . . .

OCR - Virginia Beach City Schools 2012
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