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Author Topic: Mylan Ad Frenzy Part II  (Read 25669 times)

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Offline SilverLining

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Re: Mylan Ad Frenzy Part II
« Reply #30 on: May 08, 2012, 03:45:30 PM »
But boo....were you happy his kid had an allergic reaction?  Had you wished it on him?

I don't think so.

Offline GoingNuts

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Re: Mylan Ad Frenzy Part II
« Reply #31 on: May 08, 2012, 04:16:29 PM »


I don't think they see it that way. Their press release after the first brew-ha-ha was very informative. They said  90% of allergic people do not carry epinephrine. We could quibble with the accuracy of that statistic...but since they do it for a living, I'm gonna assume they're right and the vast majority of allergic people do not.



I am woefully behind in this thread - hope to have time to catch up if I get a day off on Thursday.

But - just had to respond here.  I meet an astonishing number of people who have FA's , insect allergies and drug allergies who do not carry epi.  I work with several of them - all health professionals.  ~)  And it's not just them, but some of their children.  And yes, all have been formally diagnosed.

True story - my friend's DH did have an epi, but used to leave it in the car.  As in, for years.  One night she came home and he was in bed at 6 PM, unresponsive.  He had been stung by a bee and decided to just come home and "sleep it off".  She called an ambulance, and fortunately, he was OK.  You would think he would have seen the light after this incident, but you would be wrong.  He was DS's baseball coach, and was always out there in the field that was filled with clover and the accompanying bees.  Without his epi.   :disappointed:

I have no doubt that their 90% estimate is correct.
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Offline Mfamom

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Re: Mylan Ad Frenzy Part II
« Reply #32 on: May 08, 2012, 04:29:37 PM »
yeah, my nephew has bee sting allergy, but pretty much refuses to carry epi pen
my ds friend's dad has bee sting and when my ds realized he doesn't have an epi pen, ds wanted to give him one for his birthday. 

you have to wonder.  do people really not "get it" that not having an epi pen is risky?  or do people just think they will be okay? 
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Offline booandbrimom

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Re: Mylan Ad Frenzy Part II
« Reply #33 on: May 08, 2012, 04:39:20 PM »
But boo....were you happy his kid had an allergic reaction?  Had you wished it on him?

I don't think so.

I don't think I hate anyone enough to wish this life on them. No melodrama...just think that's a horrible thing to do. When I heard his kid had an allergy, I was very sad for them.

Cassandra Stein must truly be a saint.
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Offline CMdeux

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Re: Mylan Ad Frenzy Part II
« Reply #34 on: May 08, 2012, 04:41:45 PM »

I'd like to think that I'm not so unbearably petty that I have to force someone whose life isn't so limited (because hey-- not everyone IS allergic to a ubiquitous food, and not everyone is contact sensitive, YK?) into walking in MY shoes just so that I don't look like such a loon.

I think that's my new favorite quote.

Honestly - the people who think we're crazy are ALWAYS going to think we're crazy. It's taken me years and years to get there, but it's so freeing once I did. Mylan's ads aren't going to help or hurt that, so more power to them if they want to get more Epi-Pens in mothers' hands, regardless of how they do it.

Food allergies are an individual disease. When it comes to walking in each other's shoes, we're all Cinderella.

 Awww-- thanks. 
:yes:


Those of us who are-- er, "lucky" enough to have multiple generations/family members with varying food allergies know this one.  Management is highly individual because the condition is, too. 

As noted before, this is one that we live every day in our house.  My DD and I both have to be a lot more cautious than DH does, in spite of the ubiquity of his allergen (soy) relative to ours.  It's a matter of sensitivity and threshold in our specific circumstances.  Another family might have exactly the opposite situation, with a PA child who is far less limited than a soy-allergic parent.

  There isn't anything wrong with how any of the three of us manages, but it sure looks dramatically different to outsiders.    It has to be confusing to them, I think.  We're like the three bears.   ;D DH seldom mentions his FA in a restaurant, (though he's VERY careful what he eats when out, and avoids high risk items completely), and DD's allergies are so limiting that she's never set foot in our local schools and has eaten in only a small handful of restaurants in her entire life.  I'm somewhere in between those two extremes.  It's as though calling us all "food allergic" is ludicrous, since there really ought to be two or even three different terms.

I think this leads us to be a little more forgiving of ignorance in others.  People really can't know what they don't know, in some ways.  If they've seen "food allergy" equal my DH's reality, they can't really understand what my DD's reality is in that context.  Seeing/experiencing is truly believing.  I would have been skeptical, too.   I'm oddly glad for Joel Stein himself, in that he's learned something by walking a mile in the shoes of those he dismissed as crazy... but I'm certainly not glad for his child, nor would I really have "wished" this on anyone's family. Mostly I'm terribly sad for them, and to have the diagnosis play out amidst that kind of publicity and eating a heaping plate of crow must have been truly god-awful.

And amen to never saying "never" with this thing.  I've felt off-balance for a decade and I've finally decided that I'm just never going to be that sure of myself again.  LOL.

I've known those medical people that seem to have profound cognitive dissonance at work, too.  I'm not sure how to reach those people.  Because they already "know" in the hypothetical sense, but they've based their decision-making on some form of denial that I can't quite wrap my head around.  So I'm not sure that there is a good way to break through that without making them uncomfortable.  They've constructed a world-view in which they are "not like those people" despite all evidence to the contrary, and they can rationalize (or just deflect/avoid) endlessly to just not face the reality that they ought to be carrying emergency meds.  That would be admitting that they are like "those" people.  KWIM?

It's the same logic that some people use to avoid recieving public assistance even while your kids are hungry.  As long as you avoid thinking about it, you can avoid facing the fact that you ARE one of those "unfortunate" people.  There's some really interesting psychology surrounding this, for sure. 

I'm curious to know what your take on that strange quirky thought process is, Boo.
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Offline ajasfolks2

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Re: Mylan Ad Frenzy Part II
« Reply #35 on: May 08, 2012, 05:12:31 PM »
I appreciate that they are trying to get people to carry epi pens, but why not put out a complete message....avoidance, preparedness, etc.


Q:  Why not?

A:  Because Mylan is not in the business of selling avoidance or true preparedness.  They are in the business of selling Epipen Jr. and Epipen.



 ;)

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**(&%@@&%$^%$#^%$#$*&      LOL!!   

Offline booandbrimom

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Re: Mylan Ad Frenzy Part II
« Reply #36 on: May 08, 2012, 05:17:26 PM »
You know, I've thought a lot about what I would do if I were that Mylan brand manager. (I'm connect to the guy in about 20 different ways on LinkedIn...) I just don't have an answer. This is a really, really hard marketing puzzle to crack. That's why I suppose I'm willing to give Mylan more leeway. My guess is that they've done quite a bit of market research already and, for whatever reason, this message at least partially works.

It's taken me a while to realize that the reason it probably doesn't bother me is that I *have* written other people off when it comes to social judgment. Now it's just about getting what we need and not investing emotionally in others. Of course, my kid is older -- I certainly didn't feel that way during grade school, when parents were still picking sides. (Incidentally, one of the top search term is that brings people to my blog is "crazy peanut allergy parents." Wish I were kidding.)

I do think skipping the Epi is not about expense or hassle. I think it's about that coolness thing. My SIL has a bee sting allergy. She's been to the ER at least twice that I know of, and yet she wouldn't be caught dead carrying an Epi-Pen. (Bad expression?) She's very, very cool. Her kids are not wussie.

I wish there wasn't such an association between food allergies and WIMP, but there just is. I watched a re-run from "The Big Bang Theory" last night where they essentially set Howard up as a big wuss because of his peanut allergy. How do you fight that? Can you blame people for wanting to keep an allergy quiet and saying things to the school like "my child is not that allergic"? I wonder sometimes which is really more risky: the possibility of an allergic reaction or the outcome of the stigmatization and bullying. 

And I suppose that's why I've stuck with the blog, despite some rather nasty feedback. I'm not going to judge parents who choose not to go all-out with precautions. Someone called me divisive for trying to give them a voice, but the truth is we're already divided. It's just that the 90% don't post on chat boards. They're busy trying to pretend we don't exist.

I do think in-your-face advocacy and one-size-fits-all solutions are the wrong approach. It will make us look even crazier. But what do I know? The woman from Anaphyaxis 911 says she speaks for the food allergy community - does she? Is the definition of the food allergy community only those parents who practice Total Avoidance with capital letters and carry epinephrine? Should we just write off everyone else?

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Offline lakeswimr

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Re: Mylan Ad Frenzy Part II
« Reply #37 on: May 08, 2012, 05:21:35 PM »
I don't think so.  I think there is a cumulative effect from the media on how people with FAs and their families are perceived and that this will add to that in a negative way.  Is it the worst thing ever?  Is it on par with the bashing articles and the things like Mr. Stein's article?  Not by a long shot in that sense.  But it is very serious in that I think it could cost some people their lives rather than that it will save any of the lives of those who don't already have an epi pen.  Having an epi pen alone isn't really enough, anyway.  One has to know not to put it in the fridge, leave it in the car, how to use it, when to use it.  Those people who don't carry are going to hold off unless things are very dire and by then who knows.  I personally think this is a more harm than good ad campaign. 

The #s are very, very different for adults than they are for kids.  I can't believe 90% of children under 20 who have epi scripts don't fill them.  I can believe that a high % over 20 don't. 


I'd like to think that I'm not so unbearably petty that I have to force someone whose life isn't so limited (because hey-- not everyone IS allergic to a ubiquitous food, and not everyone is contact sensitive, YK?) into walking in MY shoes just so that I don't look like such a loon.

I think that's my new favorite quote.

Honestly - the people who think we're crazy are ALWAYS going to think we're crazy. It's taken me years and years to get there, but it's so freeing once I did. Mylan's ads aren't going to help or hurt that, so more power to them if they want to get more Epi-Pens in mothers' hands, regardless of how they do it.

Food allergies are an individual disease. When it comes to walking in each other's shoes, we're all Cinderella.

Offline lakeswimr

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Re: Mylan Ad Frenzy Part II
« Reply #38 on: May 08, 2012, 05:28:21 PM »
I think there are different ways to look at the group who doesn't carry.  The idea that they won't carry even though they know the risks almost sounds like a judgement they at least a good % are *stupid* and *negligent*. I'm sure some are but I don't think that is true of most.  I sound like a broken record but I think for many it is lack of education.  And for those over 20 they didn't get the right info and have lived all these years doing things a certain way.  It has worked so far.  My thoughts on asthma control are outdated because i grew up before current standards of treatment existed.  I luckily fit into a category where my way of handling my almost non-existent asthma is OK per my allergist but if my asthma got worse I would feel resistant to changing how I handle it *because I'm used to living the way I have all my life*.  I know the same is true for others who have ana allergies and should carry epis.  They have been fine so far and don't have the same concepts about anaphylaxis that those who are younger or have younger kids and got good info from docs do. 

I think Mylan should make ads that encourage people to carry epi pens, that encourage those who may have FAs to see an allergist or at least a doctor of some sort, that make carrying an epi seem like no big deal. 

 
You know, I've thought a lot about what I would do if I were that Mylan brand manager. (I'm connect to the guy in about 20 different ways on LinkedIn...) I just don't have an answer. This is a really, really hard marketing puzzle to crack. That's why I suppose I'm willing to give Mylan more leeway. My guess is that they've done quite a bit of market research already and, for whatever reason, this message at least partially works.

It's taken me a while to realize that the reason it probably doesn't bother me is that I *have* written other people off when it comes to social judgment. Now it's just about getting what we need and not investing emotionally in others. Of course, my kid is older -- I certainly didn't feel that way during grade school, when parents were still picking sides. (Incidentally, one of the top search term is that brings people to my blog is "crazy peanut allergy parents." Wish I were kidding.)

I do think skipping the Epi is not about expense or hassle. I think it's about that coolness thing. My SIL has a bee sting allergy. She's been to the ER at least twice that I know of, and yet she wouldn't be caught dead carrying an Epi-Pen. (Bad expression?) She's very, very cool. Her kids are not wussie.

I wish there wasn't such an association between food allergies and WIMP, but there just is. I watched a re-run from "The Big Bang Theory" last night where they essentially set Howard up as a big wuss because of his peanut allergy. How do you fight that? Can you blame people for wanting to keep an allergy quiet and saying things to the school like "my child is not that allergic"? I wonder sometimes which is really more risky: the possibility of an allergic reaction or the outcome of the stigmatization and bullying. 

And I suppose that's why I've stuck with the blog, despite some rather nasty feedback. I'm not going to judge parents who choose not to go all-out with precautions. Someone called me divisive for trying to give them a voice, but the truth is we're already divided. It's just that the 90% don't post on chat boards. They're busy trying to pretend we don't exist.

I do think in-your-face advocacy and one-size-fits-all solutions are the wrong approach. It will make us look even crazier. But what do I know? The woman from Anaphyaxis 911 says she speaks for the food allergy community - does she? Is the definition of the food allergy community only those parents who practice Total Avoidance with capital letters and carry epinephrine? Should we just write off everyone else?

Offline Ra3chel

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Re: Mylan Ad Frenzy Part II
« Reply #39 on: May 08, 2012, 05:56:18 PM »
This print ad doesn't bother me at all. 

Agreed. What I get from it is acknowledgement that sometimes living with allergies involves calculated risks, not "You can eat anything if you carry an epi-pen." Frankly, that's a message I'd like to see more: particularly as kids with allergies grow up, the idea of informed decision-making becomes much more applicable to their lives than uniform, blanket precautions.

Frankly, most people with LTFA will, at some point, make a stupid decision or take a calculated risk--and even extreme, highly-conscientious avoidance isn't a guarantee. EVERY precaution we choose to take--or skip--is a matter of playing the odds; and some people will always play more conservatively than others. Frankly, it's nice to see an ad acknowledging the extent to which ever one of those choices is a gamble.
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Offline Mfamom

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Re: Mylan Ad Frenzy Part II
« Reply #40 on: May 08, 2012, 06:23:25 PM »
I just wish that the message wasn't put forth in a way that could translate to Eat that Cake with Who knows what since you have your epi pen you're good.

I have a person in my life who lives just this way.  Any time I try to say "maybe the toppings at the make it yourself place aren't such a good idea since there are peanuts, walnuts and other stuff in the bins right next to the gummy bears?"  Oh, I have the Pen. 
This ad seems to reinforce this message. 

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Offline booandbrimom

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Re: Mylan Ad Frenzy Part II
« Reply #41 on: May 08, 2012, 06:27:57 PM »
I appreciate that they are trying to get people to carry epi pens, but why not put out a complete message....avoidance, preparedness, etc.


Q:  Why not?

A:  Because Mylan is not in the business of selling avoidance or true preparedness.  They are in the business of selling Epipen Jr. and Epipen.


Ajas, I've wondered all day since I saw that post from your compatriot. Do YOU agree that Mylan wants kids to go into anaphylaxis so they can sell more pens?

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Offline Mfamom

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Re: Mylan Ad Frenzy Part II
« Reply #42 on: May 08, 2012, 06:30:50 PM »
I think it is so funny thinking that carrying an epi pen is considered "uncool".  I think it is a combination of things.  You would think that when your child is dx with a food allergy or you've witnessed them during a reaction, your instincts to protect would kick in. 
I think back to when my ds was born.  I read every book about babies, read every manual for carseats, made it my business to know how to take care of my baby.
My friend had a baby same time.  She never put the handle down on the infant carrier when she put him in the car.  A segment was on about it in the news where a baby had died or something.  She still never put the handle down.  not because she didn't love her kid, I don't know why she didn't act on the information she had.
We see parents who love their kids not insist on them wearing seatbelts or bicycle helmets.  They know it is a law (both) but they don't act on the information. 
Maybe just human nature, IDK
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Offline booandbrimom

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Re: Mylan Ad Frenzy Part II
« Reply #43 on: May 08, 2012, 06:35:07 PM »
This print ad doesn't bother me at all. 

Agreed. What I get from it is acknowledgement that sometimes living with allergies involves calculated risks, not "You can eat anything if you carry an epi-pen." Frankly, that's a message I'd like to see more: particularly as kids with allergies grow up, the idea of informed decision-making becomes much more applicable to their lives than uniform, blanket precautions.

I think about this all the time. There's no guarantee because I deal with allergies one way that my soon-to-be-emancipated child will deal with them the same way. There comes a point where they have to own the risk.

The worst case would be that my over-reaction is programming my kid to under-react. I hope I've struck the right balance...but I won't know until he's out there.
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Offline SilverLining

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Re: Mylan Ad Frenzy Part II
« Reply #44 on: May 08, 2012, 06:47:13 PM »
Well, people who are objecting to the "let them eat cake" aspect of the ad.....do your kids EVER eat in a restaurant, take out, etc.  EVER

Cuz, if your child EVER eats food in a place like that, it is the equivalent of eating the cake.  Both are things that you can speak to whoever prepared it and make a decision.  And both can result in an inaccurate reply.

Would you feel better about the ad if the picture were a restaurant?  And what food should be served?  I think the cake works.