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Discussion Boards => Schools and Food Allergies => Topic started by: ajasfolks2 on June 04, 2013, 03:43:05 PM

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Title: "Use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: ajasfolks2 on June 04, 2013, 03:43:05 PM
http://www.lcps.org/cms/lib4/VA01000195/Centricity/Domain/4996/gummy%20lab%20Permission.pdf

From that:

Quote
Your child will be participating in many scientific investigations this year during Science 7.  Several of these investigations involve food products as we investigate life functions.  Additionally, we have found that using familiar food products to model challenging abstract concepts significantly increases retention. 



I would really appreciate any and all commentary -- esp from some of our educators here.

I will reserve comment . . . lots I want to say but will hold my water for now.

Title: Re: A "use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: twinturbo on June 04, 2013, 03:59:31 PM
This reads oddly like an LSAT question. Any number of things can increase retention, as well as surpassing the use of food products, or not using them at all. It reads purposely broad to be true yet completely without context on order to not be handily dismissed as an extremely weak argument. This would begin and end as a "Cite your source."

On the other hand if one were investigating zoological or botanical science or food science then fundamental nature and all. But blanket use as a retention device, further insinuating it is default superior retention device unrelated to the fundamental underlying material. Gimme a break.
Title: Re: A "use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: ajasfolks2 on June 04, 2013, 04:21:55 PM
In one way, I view it as a middle school version of the "safe treat" box:  another EXcuse to EXclude! 

Title: Re: A "use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: ajasfolks2 on June 04, 2013, 04:23:01 PM
IMHO, this one permission slip sure does help support the case that the unnecessary food IS the barrier to the education!!!
 :banghead:

(Thank you, Pete Wright, for agreeing with me on this some years back . . . )   :smooch:
Title: Re: A "use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: YouKnowWho on June 05, 2013, 06:16:52 AM
I see the other side of it (though I have not clicked on the link as of yet due to sketchy coverage).

Having a list ahead of time and the ability to work with teacher (and not deal with their hired henchmen, aka room parents), gives me the ability to brainstorm more than five minutes.  DS1s safety and inclusion this year was mainly do to a teacher pulling crap out of her aspirin at the last minute.  Lack of planning on her end, forced me to pull my hair out and burn holes in my stomach.
Title: Re: A "use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: Macabre on June 05, 2013, 07:30:43 AM
Yes, I appreciate the fact that they are at least aware this this can pose a problem.  I assume a 504 plan would supercede any wholesale permission given through this slip. 

I've come to the place that it's just not realistic to expect food not to be used in school.  And high school is worse than middle school--at least our experience.  But if I can work with the teacher well in advance of the event so that it is safe, we're good.

And in high school, I have been mostly hands off. 
Title: Re: A "use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: twinturbo on June 05, 2013, 08:16:48 AM
Agreed on food in schools pragmatically speaking. It's the argument the school makes that the  purposeful addition of food products to the curriculum that otherwise wouldn't involve it increases retention, which is what I believe caught Ajas' attention initially. From what I understand that's similar logic to food rewards for performance.

What's the colorful phrase? "Blowing air up my skirt"? I understand it's cheap, it (candy, typically) can be used to modify behavior as many devices can, and generally innocuous to the majority population. Even without allergies I'm opposed to the use of food in lessons to modify behavior... to the point I'd homeschool instead without food if the public school's definition of inclusion means using safe gummy bears for math, geology, etc. Worksheet + candy /= curriculum.

Not that in any way discounts what parents would like to see or perceive differently. I could occupy a different part of the continuum on this whether it's on principal or based on unrealistic expectation.


There's another way to differentiate this that I hope may be useful.

Operationally, we all have to deal with food in schools as FA parents. Give or take a bit it's about the same for all of us along a standard bell curve once you account for individual factors.

My problem with claim on the slip what Ajas asked for input on is the logic. It's a weak superlative upsell akin to nothing cleans better than Brand X. Which does not preclude the existence of many other brands that clean just as well, possibly for a better price, longer lasting, has other positive effects besides clean. Or women make decisions based on emotion which is true but so do men so an incomplete statement makes it appear that only women make decisions based on emotion and are therefore more emotional.

My husband's problem with the claim is veracity based on misinterpretation. As a researcher and instructor in human behavior he knows it's absolute bs that food is a necessary device for increased retention. Likely there was some research using food as a sensory stimulant compared to a control that showed a higher positive effect when food was used, but that could correlate to many things that stimulate senses. For example on 100th day does it matter to use Rice Chex or similar sized plastic beads of multiple colors and shapes?
Title: Re: A "use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: SilverLining on June 05, 2013, 12:09:06 PM
Quote
____ My child DOES have a SEVERE food allergy. I request that the class not complete activities with the following ingredients (please list below, mark with a *, and indicate severity and/or concerns):

That is one of the options.

~~~

a teacher that I know IRL has occasionally called me to make sure something is safe.  Her student is pa only, and the mom is pretty laid back about it.  "don't feed him peanuts". The teacher wants this student involved in everything, and takes the time to find out what products are safe (no may contains) and spends her own money on it....for the entire class, not something different for the kid with pa.

for an end of year activity day, the school was providing some kind of Mr. freezie, but not knowing the brand, I couldn't confirm safety.  So she spent her own money to buy her class Chapman's Popsicles.

Another time they were studying archeology.  An inexpensive and fun "dig" to provide the students is chocolate chip cookies.  She asked me which brands were safe.  Kids weren't supposed to eat the cookies....but they do.  She purchased the safe brand for all the kids.

This teacher does not use food constantly in the classroom, but she does occasionally.  I don't think she allows birthday treats in the class either.  Not sure if it's a school rule, but she doesn't like the constant mess and sugar high the kids end up on.  (She is an "all things in moderation" type of person.). Plus, I think her opinion is you should celebrate your own child's birthday at home and not expect her to supervise it for you.  (Why don't more teachers feel that way?)
Title: Re: A "use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: maeve on June 05, 2013, 02:55:31 PM
Quote from: Macabre on June 05, 2013, 07:30:43 AM
Yes, I appreciate the fact that they are at least aware this this can pose a problem.  I assume a 504 plan would supercede any wholesale permission given through this slip.

I've come to the place that it's just not realistic to expect food not to be used in school.  And high school is worse than middle school--at least our experience.  But if I can work with the teacher well in advance of the event so that it is safe, we're good.

And in high school, I have been mostly hands off. 

Not in the case for this school district.  I have received four "permission" slips this year for a MS in that same school district.  The first was for a science experiment in which the students made s'mores.  The next three have been in the past couple of weeks.  One was for a "cupcake wars" good behavior award in DD's science class (yes the reward was cupcake and junk food party; if I didn't want DD to participate, we were given the option of her being sent to another class to work and being brought back when the food was gone).  Another was for her 6th grade team "nacho fest" which was held Monday, and the last was for today's junk food to accompany watching "The Lorax" in science.  Yesterday was the 6th grade field day and we were not given any notice that food (cotton candy, popcorn, and snow cones) would be served.  DD texted me seeking permission to get something be she could not see ingredients listed for the snow cone syrup so she got out of line and didn't get anything.

The Lorax permission slip only mentioned peanuts, though DD is also allergic to tree nuts and eggs (I have no problem with kids eating cake or cookies near her--scrambled/hard boiled eggs are a another story; however, nuts are a no-go in her classroom).  We were sent these permission slips at the same time as all the parents in the classes, so we did not have an opportunity to correct any errors.

We have a 504 in place that states we are to be notified ahead of time.  This will be addressed with DD's house dean, who also happens to be the 504C for her school.
 
Oh there was another use of food in DD's English class where the teacher used Goldfish for something related to character development.  The teacher emailed me well in advance of the lesson.  I decided to provide the Goldfish for the entire class; I hate the idea of teachers purchasing stuff with their own funds.  There was also a day when the English teacher let the kids wear PJs, have hot chocolate, and read a book.  She hunted down a source to get hot water for DD and I sent in a safe cocoa packet and some safe mini marshmallows.
Title: Re: A "use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: twinturbo on June 05, 2013, 03:08:11 PM
Quote from: SilverLining on June 05, 2013, 12:09:06 PM
The teacher wants this student involved in everything, and takes the time to find out what products are safe (no may contains) and spends her own money on it....for the entire class, not something different for the kid with pa.

But that effort wouldn't be spent on behalf of my child's safety or contribute positively to his general health including dental. It would be on the teacher's own behalf so he or she may continue to keep the candy in the curriculum.

Even though my child is allergic to hen's eggs we go out of our way to make sure he's able to attend farm field trips with parental supervision so he can participate. It's part of the essential nature of that activity.
Title: Re: A "use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: CMdeux on June 05, 2013, 03:20:51 PM
That's what it gets down to for me personally; what is the FUNDAMENTAL NATURE of the planned activity?  What are its essential goals?  How are they measured?

What integral role-- if any-- does food serve in answering those questions?

That determines whether full or partial inclusion is possible to begin with.  From there, as an advocate, of course, I have to work within the framework of how integral OTHERS see the food to be.

Generally this is an idiosyncratic perspective, and asking for evidence/documentation of necessity or improvement in outcomes on the basis of including food makes one extremely unpopular... but it can be a 'winning' strategy, so far as it goes.

Of course, in extreme cases, you get safety without inclusion as they isolate the allergic person and continue on their merry way with the festival of food.

Title: Re: A "use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: twinturbo on June 05, 2013, 04:03:33 PM
On point this is where and when I lock arms with other parents like Bettina from The Lunch Tray. We don't ask for a egg free room but we do expect that the educational service we're paying for (fully independent school tuition) concentrate on academic activities. For that college tuition price tag it'd better be more than Worksheet + Candy = Curriculum.

We have safe chocolate chip cookies at home. We eat them at a table only after a meal. Geology? I bought a set of rocks & minerals for $26, nice magnifying glass for about $3, library DVDs free rent and a Smithsonian guidebook for about another $11. I will be thrilled to loan it to the school if they need it and I'll throw in a geode.

Sorry, that turned into a rant.
Title: Re: A "use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: ajasfolks2 on June 05, 2013, 04:46:02 PM
What, twinturbo?  You didn't believe that ROCK CANDY would be integral and indispensable as a learning tool for the geology?  I'm certain that your kiddos will never retain squat from their geology lessons because you didn't teach with candy.   ;D

Maybe there is some kind of study that indicates better retention for (Virginia) SOLs if candy or other food crap is used . . .  ~)

maeve -- thank you for sharing that info from your current (and your DD's) personal situation-- that is the kind of info that your local food allergy network would like to know about as they continue to tweak and improve (yes, sometimes school-by-school) the food allergy policies and health/wellness policies in the county!

Yes, there seems to be a renewed *love* of cupcakes and use of "cupcake war" type events in schools.  Guess they couldn't come up with other alternatives, eh?  I don't think it's funny or cute or acceptable.  I believe it's uncreative and lazy and a cop out and part of our society's continued disregard for food as sustenance and our society's downward spiral into food addiction.

Wonder when we'll hit bottom?  What childhood diabetic and obesity rate will it take?

How many more classroom / school ana reactions and deaths will it take?

Why is use/abuse of food and the adult's need-to-feed more important than the health and safety and life of ALL the students in his/her charge?

Why?

Just.why?


 :crazy:

Title: Re: A "use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: Macabre on June 05, 2013, 05:01:22 PM
Quote
Maybe there is some kind of study that indicates better retention for (Virginia) SOLs if candy or other food crap is used . . . 

Oh you know there is. Our VA middle school cited it. And used Bob's for all the kids with PA simply because that's what I supplied for DS. But apparently they only help in math, because they were only used for math.

:crazy:
Title: Re: A "use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: ajasfolks2 on June 05, 2013, 05:09:08 PM
I wouldn't be surprised if somebody is offering "energy" drinks to kids at testing time.

And not just in Virginia.

 :disappointed:
Title: Re: A "use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: maeve on June 05, 2013, 05:16:54 PM
Quote from: Macabre on June 05, 2013, 05:01:22 PM
Quote
Maybe there is some kind of study that indicates better retention for (Virginia) SOLs if candy or other food crap is used . . . 

Oh you know there is. Our VA middle school cited it. And used Bob's for all the kids with PA simply because that's what I supplied for DS. But apparently they only help in math, because they were only used for math.

:crazy:

Thanks.  I forgot that DD was allowed to bring in unwrapped candy for one of her SOLs.  We sent her with Skittles.  We didn't receive anything home about that either.
Title: Re: A "use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: Janelle205 on June 05, 2013, 05:37:31 PM
Quote from: ajasfolks2 on June 05, 2013, 04:46:02 PM
What, twinturbo?  You didn't believe that ROCK CANDY would be integral and indispensable as a learning tool for the geology?  I'm certain that your kiddos will never retain squat from their geology lessons because you didn't teach with candy.   ;D

While I can see the purpose of teaching some concepts using the rock candy method, why not just do the same thing with salt, instead of letting children eat something that all of their grubby hands have touched, and then has sat in the classroom for days before they eat it.  Not delicious.
Title: Re: A "use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: twinturbo on June 05, 2013, 06:14:32 PM
I should say that in going through the school options of assigned public, charter or magnet schools, parochial schools and independent it seems to me that it's ultimately how the schools are measured that drives a lot of what's coming through the curriculum structure. Did anyone ever foresee a school district being brought up on RICO charges? RICO charges.

Like many of us here, our family has been fortunate enough to have some truly inspirational teachers we have the utmost respect for, we were blessed to have such caring, competent educators for our oldest. People who went the extra mile not only to keep our child included and safe, but were really the type of people with a teaching philosophy that was more than collecting a paycheck.

The administration of k12 public schools under the auspices of how they get funding and dwindling budgets I think drives many principles and teachers to reach for the lowest hanging fruit to produce what will reward the school and further the district.
Title: Re: "Use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: ajasfolks2 on June 05, 2013, 08:30:21 PM
So, yeah.  Just felt I'd like to cross-post and quote from the "Food in Schools" thread.

GAH!!!!!

Quote from: ajasfolks2 on March 30, 2013, 06:52:20 AM
Seemed as good a place as any for this quote:


Old adage among the rangers at Yellowstone: "Once a bear is hooked on garbage, there's no cure."
Title: Re: "Use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: Macabre on June 05, 2013, 09:07:46 PM
Ah. :heart: I remember your connection there. Via Ken Burns. :heart:
Title: Re: "Use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: ajasfolks2 on June 05, 2013, 09:43:28 PM
 ;)
Title: Re: "Use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: YouKnowWho on June 05, 2013, 10:41:02 PM
And what if your child doesn't have a 504?

DS2 tests positive for peanuts but to the best of our knowledge has never had a reaction.  The numbers have been consistently high enough and has had a prior reaction history to legumes (which has since resolved), that our rather aggressive allergist refuses to challenge.

Legal or not, he has been turned down for a 504.  And I haven't pushed for it because I am in the process of fighting for DS1's who does have a strong reactive history.  And when it comes down to it, they work harder to keep a child who may or may not be allergic to peanuts safer than a child who is definitively allergic to wheat, rye, barley and egg.  Media hype plays well for one child but not another.

And it's one thing when you have only 15-30 kids on a daily basis (and probably easier since DS1 is the only one allergic to foods in his grade but it always seems to be a freaking surprise) but another when you are dealing with 6 classes of 30 students.  Yes, 504 should take care of it - but does it?  How many kids out there have parents that don't fight the fight, don't realize that 504's are available, mark their child has food allergies but no epis, do I go on?
Title: Re: "Use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: CMdeux on June 05, 2013, 10:47:22 PM
Am I reading this correctly, also, in that this is a blanket waiver, in terms of language?
  That is, does it have no specific event/date attached?

Yowza.

No way, no how would I sign that even without FA's in play.  I want to KNOW if you opt to include feeding stuff to my child as part and parcel of the instructional part of the day, tyvm.

Each. and. every. time.

Title: Re: "Use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: maeve on June 06, 2013, 10:02:58 AM
Quote from: CMdeux on June 05, 2013, 10:47:22 PM
Am I reading this correctly, also, in that this is a blanket waiver, in terms of language?
  That is, does it have no specific event/date attached?

Yowza.

No way, no how would I sign that even without FA's in play.  I want to KNOW if you opt to include feeding stuff to my child as part and parcel of the instructional part of the day, tyvm.

Each. and. every. time.



Yes you are correct.  In the case of DD's s'mores experiment permission slip, no specific day was mentioned; the form only said "in the upcoming week."  That's likely because of block scheduling (A/B) days.  Unfortunately, it lead to me not sending anything in for DD.  Thankfully, her BFF and lab partner,  has the same allergies and had safe items to share with DD.  DD called me and I OKed the items.


Trust me that even with a food allergy policy in place, it is not uncommon in this particular district for teachers to toss out candy because "the kids are working hard (reasoning of DD's 5th grade math teacher for tossing out Lifesavers)."  Oh and in this same district, the prizes for the gift wrap fundraiser generally are something along the lines of "limo pizza party" (which was even immortalized in DD's yearbook this year).  The home ec class participates in an Iron Chef like competition, one middle school goes to a local conference center on a field trip to do a food based program (again sort of Iron Chef-related).  In many ways, I think things in this district are worse since the food allergy policy was published.
Title: Re: "Use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: twinturbo on June 06, 2013, 10:50:34 AM
maeve, may I ask what the s'mores lesson was about? I'd guess melting points?
Title: Re: "Use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: Macabre on June 06, 2013, 11:39:03 AM
YKW without a 504, the answer is where it is everywhere else: if you have a school who works with you, you can expect some notification. If not, you can't.

I referred to a 504 superceding this, because the members that we have in that SD do have 504s. And I do know that SD is aware of 504s from other things they've published online.

A 504 that specifies 48 hours notice for food experiments and food events (they are different things), should supercede this. A violation can always be documented and acted upon.
Title: Re: "Use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: maeve on June 06, 2013, 01:27:32 PM
Quote from: twinturbo on June 06, 2013, 10:50:34 AM
maeve, may I ask what the s'mores lesson was about? I'd guess melting points?

I think it was about heat transfer but melting points makes sense.  I can't find the permission slip.  I thought I'd received it in an email, but I was mistaken.

Well, we couldn't get through the last day of school without food.  DD called me about 10 minutes ago to ask if she could have a Tootsie Pop that her teacher was passing out.  She read the ingredients over the phone and confirmed that the packaging was Tootsie's, so I let her have one.  ~) Ugh.
Title: Re: "Use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: twinturbo on June 07, 2013, 06:21:00 AM
I know many of us have the support of our allergists on food use in curriculums. Has anyone reported to their child's dentist what the kids are being fed in class in a school year? There are many initiatives by the American Dentistry Association to reduce or outright ban non-nutritious "competitive" foods offered in vending machines. Curriculum candy, testing candy, candy for parties, cakes for birthdays, all the just-cause candy or cakes, I think there's an argument there that this parallels the problem with vending machine "competitive" foods.

I may include a statement from the kids dentist regarding oral health in conjunction with a statement from our allergist in our next IEP meeting to keep the food use at bay.
Title: Re: "Use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: ajasfolks2 on June 12, 2013, 05:23:56 PM
The permission slip is implying there may/will be "accommodations" of sorts for those with LTFA . . . is this an attempt to NOT have a 504 . . . part of the "appearances" of being concerned and diligent in effort to NOT have 504 for the LTFA students?

Have already experienced an attempt at soft-sell of "IHCP will do" recently.

Just makes me wonder.

Title: Re: "Use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: ajasfolks2 on June 12, 2013, 05:41:44 PM
Putting these related links in here for this county (Loudoun County, Virginia) as to its food allergy policy and procedures:

The 67-page doc with the original language from 2010:
http://www.lcps.org/cms/lib4/VA01000195/centricity/domain/8942/food_allergies_school.pdf


Related :
http://www.lcps.org/cms/lib4/VA01000195/centricity/domain/8942/keys_points_from_the_severe_allergy_presentation_for_element_09.pdf


Title: Re: "Use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: ajasfolks2 on June 12, 2013, 06:00:31 PM
Quote from: ajasfolks2 on June 12, 2013, 05:23:56 PM
The permission slip is implying there may/will be "accommodations" of sorts for those with LTFA . . . is this an attempt to NOT have a 504 . . . part of the "appearances" of being concerned and diligent in effort to NOT have 504 for the LTFA students?

Have already experienced an attempt at soft-sell of "IHCP will do" recently.

Just makes me wonder.

Adding,

I guess what I'm trying to say is,

isn't this really a violation of Section 504 and process?  Cart before horse = accommodations before or without official eligibility.

Maybe they have no clue that this is outside 504 process and not ok?

Title: Re: "Use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: maeve on June 13, 2013, 11:58:33 AM
Quote from: ajasfolks2 on June 12, 2013, 06:00:31 PM
Quote from: ajasfolks2 on June 12, 2013, 05:23:56 PM
The permission slip is implying there may/will be "accommodations" of sorts for those with LTFA . . . is this an attempt to NOT have a 504 . . . part of the "appearances" of being concerned and diligent in effort to NOT have 504 for the LTFA students?

Have already experienced an attempt at soft-sell of "IHCP will do" recently.

Just makes me wonder.

Adding,

I guess what I'm trying to say is,

isn't this really a violation of Section 504 and process?  Cart before horse = accommodations before or without official eligibility.

Maybe they have no clue that this is outside 504 process and not ok?



I think it's more a result of the fact that the vast majority of their students with food allergies do not have 504s and only have the IHCP form filled out.  So they're aware of and have more students with food allergies than number of allergic students with 504s, and they're trying to cover themselves from a liability standpoint. You'll see in the forms that come home on the first day of school that there is an insurance/liability waiver that you must sign.  It's for all students and would apply if your child, say, injured herself in gym class.  That was something new this past year. 
Title: Re: "Use of food" permission slip for science
Post by: ajasfolks2 on June 13, 2013, 05:19:06 PM
Soooooooo      if refuse to sign waiver do they not allow child to attend?

just me wondering